there have been many movements of thought over the centuries, out with the old, and in with the new. so, for an exercise, explain why tolerance is better? not pro or against, just want to see how deeply this is thought about, or if everyone just preaches it becasue it’s what everyone preaches
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I'll transfer what I already posted in the other post: This is my short answer. In most situations tolerance does not hurt anyone and intolerance does. There, of course, are acceptions which is why I said this: Everything has a level and needs a balance and everything is relative. That has always been my view of the world. But this is all just my opinion. I do not claim do be any more right or wrong then awayone else. I just want you to respect me and hopefully attempt to understand me...doen't mean you must agree with it. I think respect is another good word to stick in there with tolerance.
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i think it definitely makes it ideal. In a world where war, corruption, and hate are nothing new, tolerance is the only hope of a better future.
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One more thought, I don't preach it (hate the word "preach" anyway) just because everyone else does. I believe it is the better approach then intolerance and that is way I am intolerant of intolerance! LOL I love to say that! It is such a paradox!
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well, what gain is there for being intolerant? you keep things how you like it. but you hurt someone. so depends on if you put yourself before others. which, in itself, is a whole new dilemma. when does "love thy self" because a self absorbed mess?
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question: "well, what gain is there for being intolerant? you keep things how you like it. but you hurt someone. partial answer: "I am intolerant of intolerance" deep, folks, deeper
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What some people consider tolerance, other people consider basic human rights. Can a definition of tolerance be given to better help us understand what you mean?
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if you need something to be a certain way, for your health and peace of mind, why should someone else get in the way of that? i think that's where intolerance breeds. in the fine line, or gray area, between you and the other guy. some intolerance is good. i don't tolerate people who disrespect my girls, but on the flip side that's me being a ***** to someone else. and they don't tolerate me giving THIER girls crap. it's all about perspective. and no, i don't care if you don't think i'm deep, or if i'm not answering your question. but what does "partial answer: “I am intolerant of intolerance”" mean?
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i thought it was clear. Your asked a rhetorical question to lead into your statement..seperate from that, Skeyes gave a partial answer as to why sometimes intolerance is good... as for the deeper comment, why assume it was directed at you? and Ucreate, How do you define tolerance? I am asking a serious question here, and am hoping for serious answers. But i see no reason for people to get offended at this discussion ha ha, be tolerant of my need to ask for answers.
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tolerance doesnt mean you have to like somebody or agree with what they're saying. It about not gettin in their way on their road to be who they want to be.
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tolerance can be classified under many categories, pain, love, trust, its basically all around us in our everyday life. If we didn't tolerate things in life, we wouldn't survive in my opinion. I think toleration is something that can be examined in so many different aspects. But I also think there are certain things in life that shouldn't have to be tolerated, like: morons, annoyances, boring insignificant lectures, and so on. In my own words, i define tolerance as, with standing something either good or bad, self endurement, suffering.
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"as for the deeper comment, why assume it was directed at you?" well since you said "people" it implies everyone and i am one of the people on this post. there.
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haha....so when I make a post and say "people are wierd" i am insulting you too? ha ha, thats funny. No offense, but funny
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Very into your train of thought today, aks, although too busy to participate much. My thoughts of tolerance immediately goes to homosexuality (specifically gay marriage) and racism because of my Christian upbringing and er, "alternative lifestyle" I suppose sometimes I practice intolerance to people in the worklplace with kids who desire special treatment, but because I dont have kids I don't.. so Im not saying its limited to Christians. I just thought an elevated definition by you might propel us faster to thinking deeper, as you have requested. Dictionary.com says: intolerance: 1. unwillingness or refusal to tolerate or respect contrary opinions or beliefs, persons of different races or backgrounds, etc. 2. incapacity or indisposition to bear or endure (as in intolerance for heat) I included the second one because thats where the confusion comes in: tolerance is supposed to be about people who are different, but the truth is we all have tendencies to do the things we are intolorant of.. we are all human.
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i thinks aks like to use all of our ideas listed, to scramble out his own answers at the end, hehe.
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Don't we all? I mean this site helps me really sort out my own ideas and belief system. Not that I don't start with something, but we are always changing things, taking away, adding, rearranging, etc. :)
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I needs the info..I am constantly evolving and changing..my beliefs today are not all the same as they were 5 years ago..some I keep, some I discard..but I need the mental exercise to keep going..and really, is it bad for us to give the brain a workout every now and then?
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I'm going to do a homework assignment. I'm going to go home and brainstorm ideas on tolerance and what might be important to point out about it, then come back tomorrow and list it all.
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sounds great..I am going to take a shower before my dog bites me..Ah, how often the mundane intrudes on the esoteric
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"haha….so when I make a post and say “people are wierd” i am insulting you too? ha ha, thats funny. No offense, but funny" well if i've said something along with others in that post, and then you go; "you people are weird". then yeah. but i wasn't offended. you always think i'm offended. and i seem to make you laugh. and not in the good way.
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This is just my opinion Tolerance - The capacity for or the practice of recognizing and respecting the beliefs or practices of others Tolerance means thinking carefully before speaking Tolerance is sometimes belittled by conservatives as a wishy-washy virtue that stands for nothing, but the people comments show, by default, that tolerance is a practice that has to be learned and exercised in a democracy. The practice of tolerance involves self-restraint and thinking carefully before speaking in public. It involves speaking in ways that take account of and display consideration for others whose views may differ from yours. Well, some people take the meaning of tolerance as accepting EVERYTHING on an equal level. Others see it as accepting and believing what another believes. Well, I must say that neither of those beliefs of what tolerance is is true. Not everything is on an equal level because there are some things out there that are evil or contribute to evil. Allowing acts of torture is not tolerance. Unfortunately, the dictionary doesn’t take the meaning of tolerance to a higher level of explanation, thus there is room for much confusion. Tolerance is accepting that another person has ideas different from yours and they have every right to believe strongly about it, just as you believe strongly about yours. True tolerance is accepting that they can believe that as long as it does not contribute to any forms of harm. It is only in cases of harm, physically or mentally, that you not tolerate it
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bravo, and that sentence brings up the question of what institutes mental harm. Does sexual activity and cursing on television contriubute to mental harm in children?
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I to the Z are you offended by how ilaugh? ha ha. I am sorry, I could not resist.
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"I to the Z are you offended by how ilaugh? ha ha. I am sorry, I could not resist. " you are either being mean or thick headed. or both. xP
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I am JOKING!! for the sake of all that is decent and clean, why DO you take everything to heart?
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i DON'T that's one of my whole ******* points lmao
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I’ve thought about a response to this for a while I believe that tolerance is ideal. How could society exists without it. You have to respect others religious and political and social beliefs if you wish them to respect yours. The world without tolerance would be a never ending war. To tolerate something is simply just to put up with it not approve of it. We are all stuck here together and toleration is the means for people to exists with different opinions . There is a big difference between tolerating something and excepting it and I believe that the distinction is lost on a lot of people. Live and let live wars are started because people wont do this
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Tolerance comes from being tolerant with thyself. We humans, certainly me included, are so shallow, you learn to tolerate almost anything or any situation. Life tempers your mind...You learn that you don't have all the answers and neither does anyone else. We ALL have problems and hangups...so, when you see yourself for what you are, you are tolerant of others as well. Even people who say you are trying to railroad your opinion...lol..
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My reason for being tolerant, or at least to some extent tolerant is that I myself have felt that because of certain choices I made, or even choices I didn't make(genetics) I was made fun of and personally did not like it. If I don't like others judging me, why should I judge them? Hope that answers you question A little AKS.
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just because the MAJORITY preaches tolerance, does that make it the ideal? Of course not. Whatever the majority preaches, isn't always correct. If the majority of the world believed that 1+1=5 it doesn't change the TRUTH or make it correct. Would just show how blind people can be, how easily fooled. so, for an exercise, explain why tolerance is better? Tolerance is better then intolerance because it allows for opinions to be heard that might never have gotten heard otherwise. It allows for more options/choices in life. It pretty much allows people to not be afraid to be themselves if their beliefs go against the majority. Intolerance is the unwillingness to recognize and respect differences in opinions or beliefs. People are going to have different opinions/beliefs then you. Whether you talk about them or not. It's a fact of life. But just because you recognize/respect those differences doesn't mean you accept them or follow them. Ever heard of "group think"?
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"group think" "mob mentality" "crowd dynamics" yep. Part of the reasons I ask questions like this, here and in real life, is to, maybe, get people thinking not only about their beliefs, but why they believe. I mean, why are most racist, racist? many people would say "they are just ignorant, or stupid" or something to that effect. But U am sure that for every 1 ignorant racist, there is one that has, in his opinion, a good reason for it, well thought out in his/her mind, and another that was raised that way, and because it was the norm for him/her, it feels correct. On a lot of issues and stances people take, I am sure the same percentage have no idea why they feel the way they do, but feel that way because, for them, it seems the majority of their peers feel the same. So, it's good to have ideals and principles, but it's great to know why you have them too.
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Hmmm...perhaps its not a definition...maybe it's a process Accept that others will have a different opinion/belief...then Respect that they are entitled to their own opinion/belief...then be Tolerant if the opinion is not agreeable with you...then be Willing to discuss the differences to see if common ground can be reached if necessary...and finally Laugh about the differences instead of fighting. Now - if those differences cause harm - there the line needs to be drawn. IE: war, physical injury etc (the exception to the rule). ***cringes awaiting the a$$kicking from AKS!***
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only a$$ kicking thing I have to say, and only to deepen the discussion...who decides where the line gets drawn? Who decides what is actually harmful? If it is each of us deciding for him/her self, then none of us will know what rules to play by haha, I quote,"ah, there's the rub"
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YUP... that's the A$$ kicking I was waiting for... for that I don't have the answer. If we can solve that - we may solve the many of the world problems here on here. It's hard to define the rules because everyone must AGREE... in order for EVERYONE to agree, well everyone would have to be brainwashed to think the same. YIKES - welcome to the stepford world!!!! So back to square one... I love a good meeting of the minds!
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ha ha ha.. you would hope that common sense and compassion would help draw the line..with a splash of morals and honor and ethics thrown in..but even those seem to be different for everyone. Humans throughout history have attempted to come up with rulebooks, but then they get altered, currupted, and dismissed as too unreasonable. so, yeah, back to square one.
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who decides where the line gets drawn? Who decides what is actually harmful? Whoever has the most power, whether it be an individual, a group, the majority.
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so, again for the sake of discussion, In todays world, that would mean the Christian church 1st, and the USA second.. I am getting tired, so I might stop making sense real soon.
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Rules/laws/sanctions - they are supposed to benefit us and keep us safe (kind of funny when you look that the super rule makers of the world...Christian/Catholic church...) Maybe is should just be as simple as the 10 basic commandments... with a little twist to make them more diverse to the entire world population 1. Don't kill 2. Don't cause physical injury to anyone intentionally 3. Accept that others will have a different opinion/belief 4. Respect that they are entitled to their own opinion/belief 5. Tolerate the opinion even if it is not agreeable with you 6. Discuss the differences to see if common ground can be reached if necessary 7. Mediate with a large group of diverse opinions when the matter affects a significant portion of the population (ha ha ha...a world counsel) Ok - someone else come up with 8, 9, and 10....
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tolerance is not a good thing... it just means you deal with something you dont agree with in a way that you do not express... i think it better to express this disagreement rather than hold it in (in a non violent way of course). true, you will hurt the opposing side, and you will most likely look like an ***. but, what if this action or idea expressed that you dont agree with is in fact wrong? wouldnt it be better to help this person/people with this belief/action? and in the case that you are wrong and you try and correct someone who is in fact right, then you yourself will better from this situation by learning truth... the truth will always come up on top :) haha i just had to take the opposing side on this argument
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Scuba....See Item 6 in the rules I propose....does that not somewhat address your concern...if not, how better to word it or add to it?
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I think the world needs both types of people, the tolerant and the untolerant. There is the person who tolerates everything, is always pleasant and open to all opinion, and would rather get kicked around than do anything disagreeable to anyone. Then there is the opposite, full of very strong convictions, sees the world in only black and white, never any gray. That person does not tolerate when the lines are crossed. When you are, for example, a parent or a boss, you find if you do not find a balence between the two you will either be walked on or hated.
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jade, sometimes a common ground cannot/should not be reached. to want to reach a common ground is to agree to a tie. i'm sure you can agree that there are some topics and issues that shouldnt be compromised on, thats all i'm saying.
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Scuba - then what is your solution to when common ground cannot / should not be reached? War? Fight? you don't think tolerance is the answer either in some cases? So then what do you propose? Seriously, what is the answer to that great mystery?
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Sorry, I just want to repeat this, and maybe explain what I mean... Everything has a level and needs a balance and everything is relative. That has always been my view of the world. Tolerance and intolerance, in the way I adopted it into my beliefs, is used in situations where rights would otherwise be violated. As an example, I always use Hitler and the Jews. Hitler and his followers could have hated the Jews all they wanted, this is my tolerance, as I believe a person's personal beliefs are a right and you should never be forced to change, throw them out, or adopt new ones because someone else wants you to. However, once killing and genecide entered into it, the rights of the Jews become the issue and there is no way I would ever be tolerant of Hitler's intolerance of Jews by trying to wipe them out. So, again, my personal belief is that I am intolerant of intolerance. I believe in basic human rights that no one should ever attempt to violate. Two of those rights are the right to live and the right to form and keep your own personal belief system. So Aks, where are you on this issue? Total tolerance and allowing someone like Hitler to be intolerant of a group of people? Total intolerance where you would act as the Catholic church did with the Christian Crusades in forcing everyone to follow the your beliefs? or where each situation is evaluated and rights weighed? There is not always a clear cut answer. But would you not agree that in most situations tolerance is most likely a better answer then intolerance? I hope I presented all that non-confrontationally. It's 2am here and I'm exhusted like always but can't sleep, so I may not have phrased all that in a way that said, "I"m not trying to change your mind." LOL So, please know that I am only curious as to where you stand and why you might say the opposite of intolerance is typically bad. Another one of my motto's is "I like questions, not statements. Ask me, don't tell me."
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definitely not, war is very seldomly (mostly never) the answer... i believe that any dispute can be dealt with in a peaceful manner... unless if its truely evil, or harming a peaceful way of life, then yes, war is needed... but then its not an issue of tolerance, its an issue of life or death. the issue of tolerance can only go so far before it becomes something bigger than just dealing with the way people believe.
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But in a perfect world, the Hitlers, would not exist if EVERYONE practiced Acceptance, Respect and Tolerance. But the world is not perfect and there will be those like Hitler that will turn up and have to be dealt with immediately because their actions are damaging, cause injury and death. We would probably be very hard-pressed to find anyone here that would not agree to that. The question is HOW should that type of person be dealt with?
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I am 50%intolerant, 40% tolerant and 10%indifferent I am tolerant of anything that does not affect others..if you like to stay home, close the windows, and dress up as a Nazi while you watch Grey's Anatomy..indifferent if you do this with the curtains wide open, and someones child might see it, Intolerant if you talk about this with me, telling me this is your kick, your bag, and how you spend your free time-tolerant does this make any sense? can you see how it applies to other situations?
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Yes, Aks, it makes sense to me.
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good explanation.. especially the part of Grey's Anatomy.. anyone caught watching that with the curtains open is indecent :)